Buy kits or build a stash?

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Quietmind
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Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Quietmind »

Hi Everyone
Have been lurking for a while now, went to view the gallery to find I have to post! So, my first question is:
I am a returning cross stitcher, currently stitching a bothy threads cut thru' a dimensions kit and several kit Christmas cards.

I want to do some bigger pieces and cannot decide whether to buy kits and get kitting quotes from HAED, or start to build a stash?

I am really enjoying my stitching, but am worried that although I know the kits are more expensive in the short term, that if I start buying threads, that could become a hobby all of its own? I have looked at a couple of HAED designs and am put off by needing to. Buy 90+ threads!

Advice please!
q
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Rose
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Rose »

Well I am a stash person. I have a few kits only because I could not get those patterns any other way.....Disney charts..... but for the price you pay for a kit you can get twice as much floss and you can also pick the type and color of the material that you want to stitch on.
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carolanne
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by carolanne »

I have stash cause stash happens. But I also have kits. I find them so convenient, everything all together. I don't think you really have to do just one or the other.
Drac
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Drac »

I'm a bit anti-kit.... Kits are much better than they used to be, it seems. (Many I see now have sorted floss, as opposed to the mixed up twist of it you used to get.) Still, I much prefer buying the pattern only. Kits almost never come with linen, which is my preferred fabric to stitch on, and I don't always want to use the color fabric the kit provides. So right there, I wind up buying new fabric anyway.

As for the floss that comes with the kits.... Originally, I hated sorting it. (Sorting kit floss was possibly the most annoying thing I can think of in this hobby.) Even though kits usually seem to come with sorted floss now, the floss is almost always pre-cut. Personally, I like to decide what length of floss to work with and I change up that length depending on the floss I'm using. So I don't like it pre-cut. Also, the floss is always loose. I'm sure a lot of people would be flabbergasted to learn I don't put floss on bobbins. That seems like a huge waste of time to me. I don't goof with floss in any way whatsoever, I was taught to use it *straight off the skein* and I store the skeins in envelopes as skeins with their paper wrappers declaring the floss's number.

So since I rarely like the cloth provided and I don't like the way the floss is provided either, I generally avoid kits unless I have utterly NO OTHER option for obtaining a given pattern.

One thing I will say about having your own stash of floss is this..... a lot of designers seem to have preferred color palettes. One of my favorites, for example, was Wentzler. It was a near sure thing that she was going to use 502, 504, 3041, 3042, 762..... I could go on, but you get the idea. She had favorite colors she used. (And the fact I can still rattle them off now without looking, speaks to how much she used the same ones.) That means that when you have your own stash, you might be buying all 90 colors the first project you do. Then you find for the next project, you only need to buy 75 of the 90 colors because you already have 15 leftover from the first one. Then the project after that, you only need to buy 60 of the 90 colors because you have leftover. Then you decide to make a quick baby bib for a shower present and you realize there's only 1 color you're missing for that.... and that's when your stash starts to save you money. :) It's not just using one designer either. Colors sometimes seem to go through fads. Seems EVERY project I do of late (new patterns) uses 3071. Why, I don't know, but when I see it on the list yet again, I don't have to buy it.... I've already got it! :)

However.... One thing to remember about a stash is that it DOES age. After a while, it seems to more easily lose it's pearl when being pulled through the fabric. Or it seems to get a weird "fuzzy" texture and tangle more easily. (Probably the beginning of dry-rotting.) Once floss gets to a certain age, I either reserve it for "junk" projects ("sure I'll make you another bib for the baby to drool all over!") or I give it to my nieces to make bracelets, or I "discard" it in other ways. (Did you know that you can brighten up some dishes, like beef rolls, by tying the rolls with colored cotton floss? YES. If it's 100% cotton -- like basic DMC is -- you can use it in COOKING. Guests love the colors! I've even grilled with it.) I'm picky and I try to stitch with floss that is less than 3-4 years old because I think the end result looks brighter, cleaner, and shinier.

So the "too long, didn't read" version of this is: I definitely recommend starting your own stash. It's not cheap to start it up, but once you get going on one, it WILL save you money in the long run. I've been stitching for almost 30 years and I can't begin to add up all the times I've NOT had to buy a color because I already had it... or could jump in and immediately start a new pattern at some bizarre time of night because I had enough of the colors to start. :)
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pattiebelle
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by pattiebelle »

carolanne wrote:I have stash cause stash happens. But I also have kits. I find them so convenient, everything all together. I don't think you really have to do just one or the other.
I agree that you don't have to do one or the other. That being said:

I used to be a kit girl until I got "burned" on one. The pattern had been duplicated so many times it was unreadable and it had been reduced in size so you could barely read the symbols. The floss was old and rotted so that it shred after only a couple of pulls through the fabric. Worst of all, the colors were all wrong to the DMC numbers listed! Compared to the DMC, those colors were dull and "off" the true shade. I was horrified.

I'm not getting any kits, any more. Having my own stash is wonderful, clean and bright, and makes it a joy to stitch...

:wub:
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Allyn
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Allyn »

Personally, I'm a stash person. I can see the benefits of kits, but they never include fabric I want and the fabric they do give is much too small for my liking and it's not the count I want. I have a choice of local stores where I can get floss, so it isn't a big deal for me to pop to the store to get a skein or two (or more) of whatever colors I need. All I want is the pattern; and in fact, I don't even want paper charts anymore -- I want PDFs because a single hard-drive (plus a hard-drive for back-up storage) takes up a lot less space than four crates of hanging-file folders.

My advice is this: Buy the pattern and gather your supplies yourself if you have sources available to you. I think buying the chart and then putting in an order at 123Stitch for fabric would be cheaper than paying for a kit, plus you'll get fabric the size, color, and count you want. Yes, it's the beginning of stash, but the colors you have left over will probably get used on a future project anyway; and if you're careful about storage, they'll be in pristine condition when you're ready to use them. The next time you pull out a chart to do and you only need to buy three or four colors because you have everything else is the payoff.

On the flip-side, if kits work for you, just go that route. :)
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curly sue
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by curly sue »

I buy kits and I have stash. I don't stitch large pieces and I use Aida, so kits fit my way of stitching. I do use stash to work up freebie charts. I also like having stash if I want to make something "right now"! :D
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Angel »

I get both.

I like to get kits because everything is there ready for you to start. The cost is up-front and clear.

I like to collect stash because it's good to know that if I see a pretty little design I have everything in that I need to stitch it. Plus playing with threads in and of itself is fun for me. I love organising and winding.

I like to get larger designs as charts because you can spread the cost out. HEAD kits tend to be over £100, we kit them at work and I've yet to see one work out less. collectibles and scarlet quince are also very expensive to kit. That's a huge chunk! Now when you look at HEADs some of those 90+ colours are only used for 5 stitches! From the ones I've kitted about a third of the threads use 1 skien or less. I already have that! I've now got almost the entire DMC collection and I've got almost all of my threads at lower than RRP and before the prices went up. I haven't actually bought any at RRP since the last price increase... So all I have to buy are the ones that require multiples. But since the first page doesn't require me to buy them all I can just buy what I need for that page. And so on. That £100 price tag works out cheaper because of stash already in and it's spread out because I don't get it all at once.
Mirabillias are another set of charts that are expensive because of the amount of charms and beads. Less expensive than those above, but still, 3 packs of gold beads in light, medium and slightly darker gold of which you only use about three beads from a pack? Just buy one pack, the difference is almost never noticeable. Blending filament, I've got six miras that all use the same gold thread for small sections. That one reel I bought for the first one, plenty enough to do all six.

And so it goes. I'm not loyal to any one method. I think all three have their place.
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rcperryls
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by rcperryls »

Personally I am a stash person. My feelings are very much like Drac's about why I don't like kits. I don't like Aida and that is what most kits (at least the ones that I have had) come with. I've had some Lizzie Kate kits that came with linen and full skeins of threads (usually not DC). I have a lot (a lot!) of DMC threads , have slowly been accumulating other overdyed and silk threads also, and now fabrics have been added to what I collect. I do think stash collecting can be its own hobby. Like most everything else with this hobby, finding what works best for you is what it always comes back to.

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Fizzbw
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Fizzbw »

Really the only kits I buy these days are Bothy Threads ones, and mainly because their deigns don't come on their own, but I trust them to be of high quality. I do have loads of kits but they are all bought as I want the design and it's not available chart only. And I will often swap out the fabric.

I have loads of stash, and it will warn you, once you start collecting then it is very very very very hard to stop....

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Hugglebunny
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Hugglebunny »

I am a big kit girl :) I have about 30 at the moment and that was after I did a bit of a cull this year. Oops!

I like the convenience of kits and I also like buying them off ebay :) these are often vintage so I save a little money then buying the kits available in the big producers' current catalogue.

I agree with the others, you can totally do both :) I think really it comes down to the pattern and if you love it, don't restrict yourself in purchasing it whether it is kitted or not! :)
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mauveme
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by mauveme »

For the cost of a few kits you could have a complete set of colours. Kit's are a rediculous price for what you get and most of the time the fabric is not the best quality, or not what I would want to stitch on.
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by crosstitcher1 »

I started out in kits, 31 yrs. this July, off and on, and I haven't bought one in the last 5 yrs.
I like going to my shop, 2 hours from me, 2 x's a yr., March, me and x-co-worker's b/d celebration and Black Fri. for "Grandmom's Day Out" with our 2 grand girls.
When I go with grand girls, it's to get my "finishing supplies" for the projects that I have done in the year, mounting boards cut to size, black paper to use on backs of my framing. Then after that, I get my "next year's projects supplies," that I have lined up for the year. A week after I finish the "current year" projects, each year depends on how many people I have to do for, I make out my list for all the supplies.
I have "all" the DMC collection, even the newest ones (4,000 nos.) from last yr. Right now I am building up the Mill bead collection, getting 3 apiece, 1 set for me, and each grand girl, in Nov.
2015, will start the family's afghans, 8. So this year will be a "bitter sweet" trip in Nov., :cry: :cry: as it will be the "last" of the projects that I frame,I frame, been framing them since 1989, "unless" a "unexpected" wedding or baby announcement " comes up. :roll: :roll:

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Quietmind
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Quietmind »

Thank you all. I think I will quietly continue my kits and start to also build my own collection.
Q
WsIP: Dimensions 'live in the moment';
Bothy cut thru North Pole house
Several cards

Too scared to start: HAEDs: world traveler bookshelf mini; in the eye of the beholder

A returning stitcher, loving how stitching gives me a quiet mind.
carolanne
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by carolanne »

I'm a bit sorry to hear so many seem to have bad luck with kits, on the whole I have been pleased with the kits I've used and I have used a lot of them. Even the ones that I was afraid were short on the edges, the framer had no problems with, not that everything I've done has been professionally framed. Also, the patterns I've liked the most have only been available in kits, and when I look at charts only, I don't find any I REALLY like. Takes all sorts...as they say.
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Mystonique
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Mystonique »

I have both. I like both. I started with kits because I wasn't sure I'd do a lot of stitching but as I got into it more the more I wanted to try alternatives ... and so the stash grew.
Myst..
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richardandtracy
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by richardandtracy »

I get the chart (well, to be exact, create it), then kit it myself.
Where possible, I use skeins left over from previous projects and don't buy more unless the calculated quantity exceeds the amount of that colour I have. Having done that I wait until I've received all the new threads I need before starting. So, I won't start until I know I can finish without buying any more.

The problem is calculating the quantity of each colour I need. At the moment I use the following formula:

Stitches per skein = (8000 * 6 * count)/ (215 * threads used in stitch)

Where:
The 8000 figure is the length of thread in each DMC skein in mm
The 6 figure is the number of individual threads in each DMC skein
'count' = stitch count in stitches per inch (eg 11, 14, 18 etc)
The 215 figure seems pretty random, but is made up as follows:
215 = length of thread per cross stitch as a multiple of the count (4.8: - 2 diagonals on the front @ 1.4 + 2 straight stitches on the back)
* 25.4mm per inch * 1.175 (15% wasted per thread) * 1.5 (safety factor for tie off & moving between rows)
'threads used in stitch' = number of threads put into needle (eg 6 for 6 count, 3 for 11 count, 2 for 18 count)

Then:
Number of skeins = number of stitches / stitches per skein and then rounded up to the next whole number.

This formula also works for tent stitches, where the thread is often doubled up compared to x stitch

However, the 1.5x safety factor is only a guess, and may not be enough if there is a huge amount of confetti.
If anyone has a better/more scientific guess, it'd be nice to hear of it.

Regards,

Richard.
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Quietmind
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by Quietmind »

Thanks Richard - those formulae are really helpful
Q
WsIP: Dimensions 'live in the moment';
Bothy cut thru North Pole house
Several cards

Too scared to start: HAEDs: world traveler bookshelf mini; in the eye of the beholder

A returning stitcher, loving how stitching gives me a quiet mind.
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NeedleAndFork
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by NeedleAndFork »

richardandtracy wrote:
The problem is calculating the quantity of each colour I need. At the moment I use the following formula:
Have you seen this table? http://home.comcast.net/~kathydyer/nf_x ... #floss_amt" target="_blank

It is what I use when kitting up a HAED, making sure to leave plenty of wriggle room. I like to stitch 1 over 1 on 28 count, which according to this chart is a smidge over 7000 stitches per skein. So to play it safe, any color that had over 5000 stitches, I bought 2 skeins and any over 10,000 I bought 3. Fortunately for the pattern I'm working on there were only 3 colors that needed more than 1 skein, so t worked out fine.

As for the kit vs stash issue, I'm a conservative stasher. I started off by buying the colors needed for my first and what I planned on being my second HAED - even though both used 90 colors each, there was an overlap of about half the colors, with many needing just afew hundred or a couple of thousand stitches of each color, so using the chart I linked above, I figured which colors a single skein would be enough for both patterns combined and only bought the one, thus saving a lot of money. Since then I've been adding more colors to my stash.. adding the colors I don't have yet to my stash when I can get them on sale. This works for me because in addition to my HAED, I do a lot of smaller ornaments that need just a small amount of a handful of colors each, so having a full (or nearly full) set of DMC allows me to start on almost any small project whenever I want. It also means when I start my next HAED, I'll have most of the colors already since most colors are used in fairly small quantities and just a few need multiple skeins.

What you decide to do is best based on what you like to stitch, and also how you organize your floss. If you're the sort that would buy a full skein for each color in each project that you have on the go anyways, then you may as well get a kit. But if you prefer to keep a single master set of floss and pull cut lengths of floss for the colors needed in the project, then stashing is the way to go. I find that to be much more efficient - before starting any project, I make my own 'kit' out of my master set of floss, setting up a project card and cutting a single length of floss in each color used. If the project uses up the entire cut length, I'll cut another and add it to the project card as I stitch.
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richardandtracy
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Re: Buy kits or build a stash?

Post by richardandtracy »

NeedleAndFork wrote:
richardandtracy wrote:
The problem is calculating the quantity of each colour I need. At the moment I use the following formula:
Have you seen this table? http://home.comcast.net/~kathydyer/nf_x ... #floss_amt" target="_blank" target="_blank

...
Thanks. That was interesting.

I had not seen that formula before. If it's transposed, metricated & generally re-arranged to try to make it equivalent, their 'Safety Factor' comes out at '1.31' compared to my '1.5'. In practice I've found '1.25' has been adequate for the types of stitching I've done so far. Hmm. May lead to a modification of my little formula to be a bit less 'safe'.

Regards,

Richard
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